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Start-Up 스타트업 [2020]


Jane

FUN BET : Who will Dalmi end up with ?   

12 members have voted

  1. 1. Who will Dalmi will end up with? Now think carefully as this is a bet. Winners can use a profile picture of their OTP. But LOSERS will have to use the face of DoSan's cousin , Nam Cheon Ho

    • Do San
    • Ji Pyeong
    • No one
    • It doesn't matter to me ( specially for Mademoiselle :P)

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  • Poll closed on 12/08/2020 at 11:09 AM

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Warning - this is an essay. :lol:

 

This writer's one of the rare few whose dramas I will watch and re-watch to get a better understanding of the story she's trying to tell. And the director - he's really good. I like how he pieces the back stories and together, and very seamlessly too into the main storyline. You will notice how he repeats scenes, but with each repetition, a new thread is tied together. Love it. Love this creative team!

 

@ChocolateMy hubs doesn't watch kdramas at all, but he likes this writer and only watches her shows. He too is of the same opinion as you - don't look at how the promo material was presented. In this iteration of the story she likes to tell (of ordinary folks, of daily pitfalls and triumphs through resilience, of love lost and love found), if the material stated up front that Jipyeong is the "chosen one", there would be no more tension in the story. It is this tension that's got us all hooked to the series now. :laugh:

 

@abs-oluteMI finally read the translated letters Jipyeong sent to Dalmi 15 years ago. You will remember scenes in the earlier episodes where they did show too that while Halmeoni started him on this letter writing thing, subsequently the letters were all him. He would check the bird house and read the letters alone, seated on the side curb and have that wistful look on his face. I actually wonder what happened when he left for the university and Dalmi stopped getting letters... 

 

About Dalmi's reactions...

Spoiler

Shouldn't she have already known? Why hadn't she actually asked more questions if she was suspicious? If the letters were so precious, wouldn't she have talked more to Dosan about them and called him out on them earlier?

 

Honestly, I think it's artistic license here. We won't see every conversation they would presumably have had, but we can make a fair guess that they did happen. Which is why when Halmeoni asked her which Dosan she liked - the one 15 years ago or the one now - she had true difficulty answering Halmeoni. For sure she likes Dosan for who Dosan is. There's nothing to not like about him. But she also knows deep down that the difference between "Dosan" 15 years ago and Dosan now seems a bit too significant, which was why the second time she tried to answer the question at the beach, she said she likes him a lot to the point where she's afraid because she has questions. And she was probably afraid to ask these questions for fear that her "perfect" image of him would be shattered. It's a difficult situation to be in - trying to reconcile memories with present realities, and whether the reconciliation would call for some level of sacrifice. And that's why she truly panicked when she called Dosan and got very upset - almost a breakdown - when the reality she was trying to hope against came true. He is NOT the Dosan of her dreams. So now she has a conflict she needs to resolve - what's actually real?

 

Dalmi is angry with everyone around her now - you see her giving Halmeoni the cold shoulder. She doesn't want to interact with Dosan. She tries to avoid Jipyeong. She can't tell what's true - her feelings for Dosan? Which "Dosan"? Did she like Dosan because of a false history he came with? What about Jipyeong? He's the real Dosan, but how much of those letters were real if it was a favour to Halmeoni? And Halmoeni! Her one and only family! She knew all along and was watching her being deliriously "in love" with the wrong guy! Imagine the anger, hurt, embarrassment of "being made the fool". 

 

I'm still rooting for JP...

Spoiler

 I can truly say I will be more disappointed if he doesn't end up with Dalmi than if Dosan were to lose her. Why? Well,

  • Jipyeong is the one who's truly given off himself for Dalmi. He understands her past, and how it ties to her present. He is her sandbox, as someone else put it. I reckon she will come to discover all the things he wrote, despite using a pseudonym, were true and sincere. 
  • Dosan on the other hand has a lot more growing up to do. He cannot give Dalmi the emotional support she needs. He is just a current distraction, I feel. 

If you were to look at all of Park Hyeryun's other stories, the final pairing was always between characters that could heal each other simply for their being tied to that same past that also brought them that hurt. Dosan does not have that connection with Dalmi. That difficult spring 15 years ago when both Jipyeong and Dalmi found and lost each other was significant to them. 

 

Let the history do the talking...

Spoiler

Another thing - Jipyeong told Dosan that he's taking back his history. Dalmi also went to Injae and told her it wasn't right to steal her memory. I do think JP and DM will go back to their history too. You can't disregard your past. They make who you are today more than you think. At least I hope that's how this story will go.

 

In the meantime, I want to go back to seeing how their businesses will move forward. I am interested to see what Demo Day will look like. I think Injae company and Samsan Tech are gonna butt heads again. 

Edited by gilaswan
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1 minute ago, ktcjdrama said:

Hahaha... been watching too much Brahms? 

Anyway, do you know it’s actually the voice of Yeo Jin Gu?

O and never mind my earlier thought about the connection with Yong San. Because full name of that’s AI Assistant is Jang Young Shil, vs. Kim Yong San. So should be no connection. I just wonder why that staff of JP seems to push for the product so much. 

Oooh... he has the same voice timbre too, both KMJ and YJG. 

 

But is it really his voice??? Whoaa.. I love hearing Young Shil anyway. Whoever voices is that. He sounds nice. 

 

Do you mean the suicidal ceo?? 

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15 hours ago, ktcjdrama said:

As for who the OTP is, whether DM-DS or DM-JP, I only go by the kdrama rule that those who kissed are the OTP 😅 so yeah, I think it’s going to be DM-DS.

 

I'm a newbie. I didn't know there was such a rule :cry: With one succint sentence, you've knocked all the logical pro JP arguments out the window :nervous:

 

11 hours ago, JenL said:

But if this writer is known for happy endings, then it will probably be DS-DM.

 

Uhmmm, there is half the population who won't think that is a happy ending... So now we have to define exactly what constitutes a happy ending for this show...

 

Quote

Let the history do the talking...

Another thing - Jipyeong told Dosan that he's taking back his history. Dalmi also went to Injae and told her it wasn't right to steal her memory. I do think JP and DM will go back to their history too. You can't disregard your past. They make who you are today more than you think. At least I hope that's how this story will go.

 

I got goose bumps reading this para. Love your essay @gilaswan 

Edit: adding photos that fit so well...

 

 

@bairama @ssteph I used to be very quiet too. Was in awe of the analysis and how everyone seems to be able to see things that I don't. And I didn't want to sound ignorant or silly. Then I decided that since I was going to spend time here, I should take the opportunity to learn and improve my observation and writing skills.

 

So to everyone, if I sound boring or too critical, apologies in advance. :smile:

 

Edited by Chocolate
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42 minutes ago, Chocolate said:

Uhmmm, there is half the population who won't think that is a happy ending... So now we have to define exactly what constitutes a happy ending for this show...

 

Haha, I meant 'happy ending' in the general sense not in the definitive sense. ie. As in, if the writer doesn't like open endings or endings were people don't end up together that is considered a "happy ending"  :laugh: Of course, to individual fans and groups, there will always be people not satisfied or critical about the ending, so it's much harder to say happy ending in a definitive sense. That's up to you personally to decide if you'll like it or not and what you decide you like, someone else may not. So yes, I'm just using the general meaning of the word :idk:

 

For me in this drama, I just really enjoy the story :wow: - it's pretty good story telling, character development and pacing. I love that the story really explores human behaviour and motivations. But I'm not very invested in any of the romances in this series which is quite funny since I often am really into the romance story line and everyone keeps pushing the romances as being so important in this series. I understand the appeal to everyone, but I'm not sure why I'm so indifferent to who Dal-Mi ends up with. I suspect it's because I've never really warmed up to DM entirely- she's likeable enough, but I don't love her (Not sure why? :thinking: She just doesn't speak to me personally, I guess and that's ok. You won't love every character you come across.) I tend not to care as much about the romance if I'm not a fan of the female character/ actress as well as the male. 

 

I personally love love love the second lead, JP. But I'm ok if he doesn't end up with the female lead as long as they give him some form of happiness for all his sufferings. What I want is for it to be fair to him too. :heart: 

 

I think this is why I can say I see DS as ending up with DM without feeling emotional. I would like JP to 'win' and come out on top for his own happiness, but I can't help feeling the route they'll go down is otherwise. Who knows though? I could be surprised too. :lol:

Edited by JenL
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I'm looking at the lyrics of One Day by Kim Feel,

 

I can’t just let go of the dreams that always remained in my heart
So call out my name when I’ve turned around once more

Far in the future, if we meet again in different times
I hope we can say we lived dazzling lives
Even if I’ve completely forgotten you
Let’s start again slowly, just like then
That dream

 

I just think it speaks to JP and DM... hahaha... I'm so rooting for poor JP. He deserves to be happy.

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@gilaswan

 

Tbh, I wanna watch because of Kang Hanna

 

But this drama focus too much on the 2 guys and 1 girl. the promotion of 4 leads is failing

Granny can replace her and be the 4th lead

 

Plot line already kind of run off track, too little focus on how a startup will start and become up and coming, too much focus on the love triangle. lack of progress on character growth, especially with the so-called 2nd female lead missing in action except appearing just for a while

 

Romance plot is boring for me. A typical kind of kdrama romance. 

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58 minutes ago, Chocolate said:

@bairama @ssteph I used to be very quiet too. Was in awe of the analysis and how everyone seems to be able to see things that I don't. And I didn't want to sound ignorant or silly. Then I decided that since I was going to spend time here, I should take the opportunity to learn and improve my observation and writing skills.

:1000: points. Omg! Please dont be sorry like you said for being too critical and try to write it simply awesome for me. Because it offers chance that back to what you said "able to see things that I don't" and somehow it maximize my drama experience to real life? Wow is this too serious? But honestly, yeah it impacts me someway. And I'm grateful for those kind of entertainments.

 

@ryanallright you've got point. I'm disappointed how they use female second lead rn too. But also from the start she kinda is living so differently with the other three, but gosh she is Dalmi sister!! I mean?!?!! Ksksksksksk. And it is already episode 10 huhu I'm praying hard they do something more about this.

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1 hour ago, gilaswan said:

If the letters were so precious, wouldn't she have talked more to Dosan about them and called him out on them earlier?

I’d like to share a personal experience about this. So, many many many many years ago, when I was young and single, I started exchanging emails with a guy who was in another country. We met in a wedding. I was from the bride’s side and he was from the groom’s side. We hit it off really well and wrote to each other almost every day in addition to chatting daily on ICQ (if you don’t know what this is, never mind, I am just revealing how ancient I am hahaa) Anyway, we arranged to meet again in an agreed country that is mid-way for each of us for easy travel. We spent some time together, but you know what happened... he kept bringing up things we have talked about in our emails and it bored me to death having to repeat things we already knew and have talked about. I was thinking of more progress but he was thinking of tracing back. Needless to say, after that meet up, the emails exchange was drastically reduced and nothing resulted. Yeah, I was the mean one to pull the plug... So, I can understand why DM does not talk about the letters because I wouldn’t either 😝

 

@Chocolate sorry to have burst your bubble of hope. But you know that people say rules are made to be broken... maybe the rule will not be applied this time and the writer will surprise us after all? It has happened in kdramaland before, that the second lead became the one who get the girl. I don’t remember if any kissing is involved or not though 😆

 

Edited by ktcjdrama
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@ryanallright I think that seems to be the case with this writer though. In While You Were Sleeping, they had Ko Sung Hee listed as one of the main cast members, but her air time was so little. I honestly wondered how she was one of the leads at all. Hahaha... But this writer never fails. Her stories are always balanced. While Dalmi is trying to figure herself out now, the focus is going to return to the business side of things. I think in the next week, we will see

 

  • progression in the relationship between the sisters as they battle it out on Demo Day. We will see Dalmi reclaiming her rightful place as the girl on the swing. Yoon Daepyo will begin to see Injae for who she is and renew her belief that the girl on the swing would have come to Sandbox for a reason other than money
  • the Samsan Tech boys growing - Yongsan will sort through his anger with Sandbox and JP; Chulsan will grow from being a dork to taking charge of who he is vis-à-vis manipulative Saha
  • mum will start to mend relationships with Dalmi and Halmeoni, and understand that family and an honest way of life is priceless

 

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5 hours ago, gilaswan said:

finally read the translated letters Jipyeong sent to Dalmi 15 years ago. You will remember scenes in the earlier episodes where they did show too that while Halmeoni started him on this letter writing thing, subsequently the letters were all him. He would check the bird house and read the letters alone, seated on the side curb and have that wistful look on his face. I actually wonder what happened when he left for the university and Dalmi stopped getting letters... 

Coincidentally, I posted that on my twitter late last night ! 
The OST that you mentioned is Kim Seon Ho’s fave as he says it is very meaningful. He mentioned it in his recent interview . Has subs 

 

 

@ktcjdrama @Chocolate Am one of the crazy people making a request to the k drama gods  on Twitter asking for rule exception ! :lol:


 

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@Chocolate You will recognise a trend once you've watched way too many kdramas (or Jdramas). For kdramas, it is very rare the second lead will get the girl, although not never. With Park Hye Ryun, the one drama that maybe the second lead got the girl is Dream High. However, it was so long ago and I didn't follow while it aired so I don't actually know if Kim Soo Hyun was advertised as the lead or second lead. This was before he hit it big with The Moon that Embraces the Sun.

 

Other kdrama rules also include:

- a kiss in the middle of the series (i.e. if 16 episodes, if the OTP hasn't kissed before then they are likely to kiss in episode 8). I actually learnt this from reading some other people's posts on my SNS and then started to notice they were right. However this rule has been broken a lot more now in recent years. I've seen kisses happened in earlier episodes or nothing until episode 12.

 

- the story is usually structured into different stages, angst usually kicks in in the second half of the episode to spilt the couple up. For a romance, the formulaic style is that there will always be some conflicts introduced to challenge the OTP after they get together.

 

I'll leave the rest for you to discover yourselves. I think it'll be more fun that way. It's a nice time to enjoy coz you're new to something.

---

 

My take on Park Hye Ryun's dramas (and essay - hahaha)

 

Scenario A

Park Hye Ryun's dramas with Lee Jong Suk has clearer loveline mainly I believe is because the actor is Lee Jong Suk. And compare his star power vs the second leads (Pinocchio, While You Were Sleeping), he's The One that must get the girl. No offense intended because I like the second leads too (Kim Young Kwang and Jung Hae In). And Lee Jong Suk seems to be Hye Ryun's fave otherwise she wouldn't offer her scripts to him so many times after IHYV.

 

Scenario B

If we look at The Page Turner and Dream High, then they aren't as clear. The Page Turner had Ji Soo and Shin Jae Ha who aren't as famous so I see them having equal screen time. BUT, there's no lovelines. In Dream High, it started out with Taecyeon with more screen time. Taecyeon back then I'd think is more well-established by name as the idol in 2 AM. Soo Hyun didn't even appear in the first couple of episodes (if I remember correctly) and as the story progresses, slowly the focus shifted to Kim Soo Hyun and eventually Soo Hyun not only got the girl (Suzy again) and is... [SPOILER ALERT!!!] the mysterious K that the show refers to in the beginning.

 

So I'd say the writing style is 2 versus 2.

 

Start-Up, however, from the outlook right now looks similar to Scenario B because both Nam Joo Hyuk and Kim Seon Ho's star powers are pretty equal in the entertainment industry. At least they are not at the level of Lee Jong Suk or Kim Soo Hyun. Agree? However I think Joo Hyuk is a bit more established than Seon Ho and he is from the same agency as Suzy i.e. SOOP (big agency with many big names e.g. Gong Yoo, Jung Yumi, Seo Hyun Jin etc) vs SALT (Park Shin Hye, Kim Ji Won). Agencies can play a big part in the drama casting/storylines too.

 

In conclusion, I'm going to let the show do its job and accept what is given to me who the final OTP is to save me the heart break. Very rarely I'd stand on the wrong ship, but it has happened before which I ignored the rule of FL and ML for Hit The Top (because I didn't believe it was logical) and I was burnt. :scaredpanda2:

 

Edited by mademoiselle
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@abs-oluteM OMO. That video. He's so adorbs! I think Kim Seon Ho's popularity will really soar with this drama.

 

He's been quite perfectly cast in this instance, and you see many people rooting for him. However, while in other dramas where they're filming live, I have a feeling Start Up is one of the few Kdramas that completed their filming before the show aired - can anyone verify this? So this likely means the ending is already a done deal. Regardless though, what I like about this writer is that she is very clear about where her story is headed. I find that writers who amend their story on the fly because of viewer opinion often end up with a messy conclusion. Anyways, part of the fun is in seeing how our predictions or reading of the stories go.

 

Right now, I am very much in love with Jipyeong. I cannot see how Dalmi wouldn't be too. Again, nothing against Dosan, but Dosan just seems like a puppy next to Jipyeong who's a lot more self-assured. Sure, Jipyeong is prickly, but that's precisely why he also seems so very sweet and sincere when you see his interactions with Halmeoni. He loves Halmeoni so much. When's he gonna find out about her condition? His heart will break into pieces for her.

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@gilaswan He's also in the variety 2D1N , does theatre and dramas - so over the years I have seen him getting recognised. But the buzz on this one is definitely something else & has boosted his popularity.

 

They have not finished filming. Both Suzy and KSH have received some food truck support on set , and just posted it on IG.

KSH received one from Mun Ga-Young  ( they were both in Welcome to Waikiki 2)

https://www.instagram.com/p/CHrlMsYDie1/

Suzy also received one from her friend Jo Hyun Ah of Urban Zakapa

https://www.instagram.com/p/CHrtEMRBtEj/

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8 hours ago, ktcjdrama said:

Anyway, do you know it’s actually the voice of Yeo Jin Gu?

TIL hahahaha no wonder it sounded familiar! Everything clicked into place when I read this :laugh:

And I just found out yesterday (yes, very belated, I know!) that there was this 'team JP' or 'team DS' thing going on, and both leads have their own haters... oh my. I mean, I'm on JP-DM ship, but that doesn't mean I hate DS or anything. I'm not averse to DM picking DS in the end, and I certainly am not putting DS down in anyway. Ship wars are so tiring (seriously like after witnessing the ones while watching Hospital Playlist, just.... no thanks).

I don't know if it's just me, but recently while I watch dramas, I don't have the energy to analyse and come up with conjectures anymore. I watch for enjoyment. Are (at least some of) the characters relatable and likeable? Is the story engaging? Does watching the drama make me feel things? Start-Up checks all my boxes so I am sticking with it and enjoying the ride, just as I do reading everyone's thoughts here. (On the other hand, I avoid reading views on twitter cos :Yikes:)

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Was watching again the scene when Jipyeong was in turmoil at home after meeting Dalmi at the birdhouse, and Dalmi then at home reading his letters again. The song playing was “Day & Night” by Jung Seung Hwan. 

 

The final verse says this,

 

“That it’s darkest

Right before the sun rises

 

Day & Night

We came a long way

And finally met

I want to hold you tight

So when you have long days

The person who makes you take a break

I hope it’s me”

 

*sigh* 
 

How can it not be Jipyeong?

 

I have to say, this writer always has the best songwriters writing for her shows. Hahaha... love love love the OSTs

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@ktcjdrama Thanks for trying to soften the blow haha!

 

Thanks @mademoiselle for the lessons ❤ I hardly watch the k-drama romances so it is most useful. I lean more towards the thrillers/suspense unless they have you-know-who LOL.

 

@gilaswan Thanks for the OSTs! They are now in my spotify list ❤

 

@abs-oluteM Just saw that you are starting a thread for Kim Seon Ho. Have fun worshipping!

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24 minutes ago, Chocolate said:

@abs-oluteM Just saw that you are starting a thread for Kim Seon Ho. Have fun worshipping!

ahahaha I had to! I passed on my thread on Forum S ,  and I had deep regrets for not migrating my stuff over :laugh: . His was the only oppa thread I opened there apart from taking over Lee Joon Hyuk's and Kim Ji Suk. 

Still a work in progress , but do drop by gals :D 

 

 

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18 hours ago, mademoiselle said:

You will recognise a trend once you've watched way too many kdramas (or Jdramas). For kdramas, it is very rare the second lead will get the girl, although not never. With Park Hye Ryun, the one drama that maybe the second lead got the girl is Dream High. However, it was so long ago and I didn't follow while it aired so I don't actually know if Kim Soo Hyun was advertised as the lead or second lead. This was before he hit it big with The Moon that Embraces the Sun.

 

Other kdrama rules also include:

- a kiss in the middle of the series (i.e. if 16 episodes, if the OTP hasn't kissed before then they are likely to kiss in episode 8). I actually learnt this from reading some other people's posts on my SNS and then started to notice they were right. However this rule has been broken a lot more now in recent years. I've seen kisses happened in earlier episodes or nothing until episode 12.

 

- the story is usually structured into different stages, angst usually kicks in in the second half of the episode to spilt the couple up. For a romance, the formulaic style is that there will always be some conflicts introduced to challenge the OTP after they get together.

 

Hahahaha, yesss!! I agree with all of this and it's been explained very well. I think if you're used to watching American shows @Chocolate, it's often less clear who the main couple will be since often the girl will date both guys and because of multiple seasons, the main guy could change due to the writer's decision for variety or casting news (actor leaves show etc). In K-drama, Because of the (usual) 1 season time frame of shows, and the agency deals/ star power, it is very very rare the second lead will get the girl. I'm sure it's happened before, but if it has, I've never watched a drama where it's happened. 

 

Ah, I never knew about the kiss rule though - I feel like it's changed a lot over the years because I've been pleasantly surprised a few times by early kiss. As for angst, there will always be angst and it's true that it'll always be in the second half of the story. And there's definitely angst after they get together....but sometimes before as well, ie. if a new girl or guy (ex partner or side character with a crush) gets introduced before they get together and tries to wreck havoc for a few episodes.

 

23 hours ago, ryanallright said:

Tbh, I wanna watch because of Kang Hanna

 

But this drama focus too much on the 2 guys and 1 girl. the promotion of 4 leads is failing

Granny can replace her and be the 4th lead

 

Plot line already kind of run off track, too little focus on how a startup will start and become up and coming, too much focus on the love triangle. lack of progress on character growth, especially with the so-called 2nd female lead missing in action except appearing just for a while

 

Romance plot is boring for me. A typical kind of kdrama romance. 

 

Wow, I rarely ever meet someone who likes the second female lead in a drama when it airs, but this time I think there's quite a few :hug: 

I have seen a lot of comments about how under utilised in the story line she is and I agree because I thought that she would have more of a story with her evil stepfather. But it's been pushed to the side for the love triangle. I guess there was also the sandbox girl mystery, but that's been cleared.

 

I don't know if I agree about the start up bit though - I feel like it has a good balance between business talk and other stories. If it was too much about running a business, it would be less of a drama, more of a start up guide and might bore people :laugh: I think there's 3 parts to this drama: Start-up life and competition / Family love & dysfunctions / Romance love & love triangle and I'm mainly watching for the family stories (which includes Halmoni and JP, as well as DM's messed up family and DS's pressuring parents)

 

I do agree the love triangle is pretty stereotypical though, especially the kind that starts shipping wars (This is what everyone looks like when fighting about DS and JP --> :pandarage:)

 

Edited by JenL
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@JenL

 

Well, I am a fan for Hanna after she appeared on Running Man, pretty impressed with her

 

tbh, wasn't a fan of Suzy's acting but she is popular in Korea and internationally, so wasn't surprised that she is the 1st female lead in whichever dramas she is in. (Hope Suzy's fan don't bash me, LOL)

 

This year only one drama had kept me in my seat and not fast forward any scene while other popular dramas which had a lot of international fandoms did not impressed me at all despite all the hype, I will just fast forward whichever scenes that I had no interest in when I view these dramas.

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13 hours ago, Chocolate said:

I don't understand why using b&w is meant to signify no hope. Anyone has any ideas?

From a photography perspective, B&W is used when the photographer wants to draw attention to feature details. It takes away distractions presented at times by colours. 

@JenLI have to say I'm quite surprised at the level of support JP is getting online on various platforms. Hahaha. It's almost as if people are protesting the DM-DS pairing, and those who are pro-DS are basically NJH fans. Hahaha... not very objective from story progression perspective. 

 

Honestly, just based on story progression and how everything is being shot, I really cannot see how it will be DS. Like most here, I don't think I'll have an issue if DS gets the girl in the end, but I don't think he's the better man. He may not be the worse option, cos there's inherently nothing wrong with him. But he's not the better person insofar as what Dalmi has been dreaming of. Jipyeong is the one who truly understands her. Until new things are revealed, my guess is still that Dosan will leave for Silicon Valley to better himself, and there is no obligation for Dalmi to wait. She is his first love, but Jipyeong is hers and vice versa (if first loves mean anything at all in KDramas).

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