The Sword & The Brocade 锦心似玉 2021

[Olivia Kate]

13 minutes ago, OsmanthusTea said:

 

Who is SML??? Small Medium Large???? Pardon my cluelessness of abbreviation..... 

 

Intentionally or not, I laughed out loud. Thank you.😊

 

The drama in the series is at its peak and it’s a bit heavy for me so I’m mum at the moment but it’s fun to read everyone’s perspectives.👍🏻😊

[SnT]

@Funnypeopleswim the rumour created around amber sister is she die of heartbreak because shw slept with houye during yuanniang pregnancy n yet she cant gain houye favour .

 

Real story is yuanniang n the mother madame luo threaten her w her sister ie Amber n make her sleep w houye. Because when a lady is pregnant n not having sex w their hubby they arrange for someone under their control to help them skeep w their hubby. Yes it is sick but yuanniang did that. Tong was forced but houye did not sleep w her. N when asked why she did it, she did not explain. HouYe conclude it is yuanniang n tong scheme again much like the one yuanniang did with shiyi n qiao n how he dislike shiyi in the beginning because he concluded shiyi colluded w yuanniang to marry in the family n reduced qiao to concubine. He disliked tong n never visited her. N the bad mouthing ppl like tao mama goes around telling ppl she is shameless yet cant gain houye favour. She died in depression, committing suicide by hanging. 

 

That is why Amber turn against houye n want to get shiyi out of xu family. She was of course lead n brain washes by qin about houye heartlessness. N how pitiful her sister was. 

 

I doubt amber will be w sml. He was imprisoned at the final episode trailer. I believe he surrendered the proof of ou cohooting w pirates in order to saveshiyi n make repentance for the ous. Poor guy. Hope they can save him but it looks bleak when he says... If fate did not twist our lives, i would be the more suitable person for u than xu lingyi.. I thought it is a heartfelt statement that shows the honesty of a man about to be executed. Because he never expressed hia feelings for shiyi in front of shiyi. 

Edited March 25, 2021 by SnT

[SilverMoonTea]

Ep 31 just too funny... Houye fell down just because Shiyi blow his wound 

[Funnypeopleswim]

@SnT

 

I will be sad for Daddi Wang if his character dies. Especially for his corrupt family. The old practice of executing the whole family for the crime of one family member is very cruel. I'm glad they don't still do that. I think it would be nice (wishful thinking I know) if they could save him and bury the grudge between the two families.

 

Amber is a weird character. She comes off smart but she has poor judgment. She's easy to manipulate. I admit the harem politics is very foreign to me. I mean I understand it, but I could never live it. Nor can I imagine hanging myself because my husband ignored me. But maybe it's was more than that. It can be lonely in the Xu mansion. Living a forced life, under the power of the main wife and mother-in-law.

 

Madam Luo is such a ruthless woman as was her daughter, Yuan Niang.    

[NiteWalker]

15 minutes ago, Funnypeopleswim said:

 

I will be sad for Daddi Wang if his character dies. Especially for his corrupt family. The old practice of executing the whole family for the crime of one family member is very cruel. I'm glad they don't still do that. I think it would be nice (wishful thinking I know) if they could save him and bury the grudge between the two families.

same for me....I will be too...he had been a gentlemen through and through....I felt it will be better if they just let him go bk to the way he is....his father is just as bad 

[JennyKimWOP]

All, I love reading all the observations.  I think that I will wait until I watch all the episodes subbed before I comment on anything.  I am still trying to figure out how this all will actually work.

 

The one thing that caught my eye - about the good Ou perhaps being a better husband for Shiyi... so it depends on what type of husband one wants.  I don't think that his personality is strong enough to withstand Shiyi's extremely strong will, and because she is so intelligent and street-smart, she probably works better with an older husband than a contemporary.  

 

Just from watching modern marriages, at first the contemporary husband loves the wife for everything she is - smart, capable, and savvy.  But at some point, he will start to feel deficient, and that's when the problems begin.

 

With an older husband, someone like Shiyi can be more expansive, and he will merely be an umbrella, rather than trying to be her shield and her everything.  Precisely because he has experienced what he has in his past (disappointment, betrayal) he will go much more slowly and be willing to accept parts and pieces of her to get the whole her, in a way that a youthful lover like Ou will not be willing to accept.  Young Ou will want the whole her immediately.

 

And with people like Shiyi, aiming for that immediately is a mistake.

 

More than trust, Shiyi seems to seek a sense of safety, and the Marquis provides that, no matter what.  So when he lied to protect her, that's when she knew that she could jump over that chalk line and actually give herself fully to him.  

 

Trust and a sense of safety are 2 different things - I learned that recently in a 12-week negotiation class.

 

Don't be fooled by the aura of trust and end up trusting too much, but do work with a sense of safety to ensure open dialogue and follow through.

 

I doubt that young Ou can provide Shiyi emotional equity - whereas the Marquis provides Shiyi emotional equity.  The Marquis gives Shiyi space... in his youthful worship and love, young Ou probably will not do that.

 

I suspect that many will disagree, but these are just my thoughts based on more than 20 years of observation about the relationships that work and don't work.

[OsmanthusTea]

1 hour ago, Funnypeopleswim said:

The old practice of executing the whole family for the crime of one family member is very cruel. I'm glad they don't still do that.

 

 

Well, China doesn't executed embezzler's family members anymore only the embezzler (in many cases) BUT the wealth of his/her first (siblings) and second (children) generation family members will be taken completely.

 

 

Edited March 25, 2021 by OsmanthusTea

[Funnypeopleswim]

Just now, OsmanthusTea said:

 

 

Well, China doesn't executed embezzler's family members anymore only the embezzler (in many cases) BUT the wealth of his/her first (siblings) and second (children) generation family members will be taken completely.

 

Seriously. OMG.

[OsmanthusTea]

Concubine Tong's story is heartbreaking. The women in that era can't trust the husbands to kept it in their britches until they resorted to force a slave to satisfied their men. The husbands also can't trust the women to be honest in their dealing. How to live like that as man and wife???

 

Edited March 25, 2021 by OsmanthusTea

[Funnypeopleswim]

2 minutes ago, OsmanthusTea said:

Concubine Tong's story is heartbreaking. The women in that era don't trust the husbands to kept it in their britches until they resorted to force a slave to satisfied their men. The husbands also don't trust the women to be honest in their dealing. How to live like that as man and wife???

 

 

This is why the situation is so foreign to me.

 

I think one would need to be raised in that kind of environment and culture. It would require a complete reset of values. 

 

 

[OsmanthusTea]

7 minutes ago, Funnypeopleswim said:

 

This is why the situation is so foreign to me.

 

I think one would need to be raised in that kind of environment and culture. It would require a complete reset of values. 

 

 

 

I am a Chinese and have been hearing that kind of real life story since I was young plus watching harem dramas so it's not that foreign for me. But I can say that women in history in every civilisation on earth had similar situation. As long as harem/polygamy existed, there will be that kind of scheming and backstabbing.

Edited March 25, 2021 by OsmanthusTea

[SnT]

@JennyKimWOP i still agree with the statement young ou suits her better. Because shiyi was only 15 when they met whilst he is young but still older than her w very worldly views in every sense (everytime he talks to his father anout maritime ban lifting, i reallt enjoyed his opinion, he sees so much n can be houye political friend if not born as an ou) n a past that is painful w his father treatment of his mother (so he knows how to love n cherish the one hv loves, in fact when he was wooing shiyi wo realising she is married, he was slow n steady too n never a young hot blooded lover style). Shiyi is at the being nurture stage n whoever she is with her growth will be different. Yes her nature is strong will. But her nature is also responsible, appreciative, calm n reasonable. It will work with young ou cause both are very gentle n calm ppl. Who will not fight n simply make each other unhappy. So w young ou her growth with very different. More carefree n less intense. Itvwill just a sweet and respectful relationship.bearing in mind that ppl on that era dont go get divorce because of something doesnt work. It has to bery serious like no children, creating discord n jealousy in family, family abuse etc. Therefore with her characters itvwill work but she will never experience the deep n intense love like w houye.

 

W houye it is a once in your lifetime experience. She need grew to be matriarch of the household under very intense stress n expectation. It is good that houye gave her the umbrella like u say. In the trailer he open an umbrella for her. So it really says something about their relationship. N their love is the type that break winds n waves together, that they will die for one another, never leave u to walk alone. The intensity is not for everyone. Tsy herself say in an interview that shiyi character biggest lost is not being able to experience the workd like she has yearn for because she still end up in that inner courtyard. But her biggest gain is also meetinv meeting houye n experience the love n warmth that she never really had before. Like u say safety n protection that he gave her that she get from her own family evwn from her mum (her mum need protection from her). 

 

I tend to think that marriage is 50% heaven will n 50% the person reaction n characters n attitude towards it. Unfortunately ou din not get that first 50% to start out. He never had the chance to grow w her. Whilst houye has to 50% n they make it work to 101%..i do feel that Houye needs a wife like shiyi n heaven is finally taking pity on this guy call xu lingyi who had done so much for his family n the people. 

Edited March 25, 2021 by SnT

[SnT]

38 minutes ago, OsmanthusTea said:

 

I am a Chinese and have been hearing that kind of real life story since I was young plus watching harem dramas so it's not that foreign for me. But I can say that women in history in every civilisation on earth had similar situation. As long as harem/polygamy existed, there will be that kind of scheming and backstabbing.

Ya same.. as a Malaysian but chinese n growing up with a father who is very chinese in thinking (we call him chinaman style - his very confucius thinking but thank god he loves me a daughter n my daughter to bits, never gals are lesser) , i m not shocked with the taboo n thinking of ppl then n u r right in evey society. Whilst i m english educated, i always say to my hubby the one thing i thank god for western effort in spearheadng this one man one woman marriage. N in Malaysia muslim still can hv 4 wives but very rare nowadays. Having more that one wife n hsving children by different spouse is just not healthy. Jealousy, scheming, backstabbing because human being cant help it to hv favouritism, then sibling rivalry becsuse different mothers (eg of bad ou n young ou, bad ou will kill his brother) , Jealousy, unhealthy competition n comparison will just create a disorderly society n very screw up individuals. 

 

With tong, try imagine this: she don love that man, her mistress force u n threaten her to sleep w him. She climbed onto his bed. Then he never slept w u n woke up disliking her because he thought she schemed w the main wife (which is a very reasonable assumption) likevas if he doesnt know this inner court sop is like. 

 

She did not die becsuse houye don  favour or love her. She died because eveyday ppl treat her like dirt because she is the shameless person who climb onto her mistress husband bed, betraying her n she still dont gain a man attention even. N she can't even shiut back n say that is not true. A form of bullying in a very narrow confined space. Something like a rape victim being told its her own fault that happen or cyberbullying. Its like being mentally  tortured daily - imagine war prisoner. she simply just lost hope w no education, no solace or help from anyone, n seeing no end to this life. 

 

 

 

 

Edited March 25, 2021 by SnT

[JennyKimWOP]

45 minutes ago, SnT said:

@JennyKimWOP i still agree with the statement young ou suits her better. Because shiyi was only 15 when they met whilst he is young but still older than her w very worldly views in every sense (everytime he talks to his father anout maritime ban lifting, i reallt enjoyed his opinion, he sees so much n can be houye political friend if not born as an ou) n a past that is painful w his father treatment of his mother (so he knows how to love n cherish the one hv loves, in fact when he was wooing shiyi wo realising she is married, he was slow n steady too n never a young hot blooded lover style). Shiyi is at the being nurture stage n whoever she is with her growth will be different. Yes her nature is strong will. But her nature is also responsible, appreciative, calm n reasonable. It will work with young ou cause both are very gentle n calm ppl. Who will not fight n simply make each other unhappy. So w young ou her growth with very different. More carefree n less intense. Itvwill just a sweet and respectful relationship.bearing in mind that ppl on that era dont go get divorce because of something doesnt work. It has to bery serious like no children, creating discord n jealousy in family, family abuse etc. Therefore with her characters itvwill work but she will never experience the deep n intense love like w houye.

 

W houye it is a once in your lifetime experience. She need grew to be matriarch of the household under very intense stress n expectation. It is good that houye gave her the umbrella like u say. In the trailer he open an umbrella for her. So it really says something about their relationship. N their love is the type that break winds n waves together, that they will die for one another, never leave u to walk alone. The intensity is not for everyone. Tsy herself say in an interview that shiyi character biggest lost is not being able to experience the workd like she has yearn for because she still end up in that inner courtyard. But her biggest gain is also meetinv meeting houye n experience the love n warmth that she never really had before. Like u say safety n protection that he gave her that she get from her own family evwn from her mum (her mum need protection from her). 

 

I tend to think that marriage is 50% heaven will n 50% the person reaction n characters n attitude towards it. Unfortunately ou din not get that first 50% to start out. He never had the chance to grow w her. Whilst houye has to 50% n they make it work to 101%..i do feel that Houye needs a wife like shiyi n heaven is finally taking pity on this guy call xu lingyi who had done so much for his family n the people. 

@SnT this is insightful and thoughtful - and 15 is not that young in that era, which is why I kind of shrugged about the age difference.

 

Also, my great-grandfather had 2 concubines in Korea so my dad's side of the family, the relationships are all complicated, which is why I did not even bat an eyelid when I saw the concubine storyline.

 

I agree with you that her relationships with young Ou and the Marquis/Houye would be different.

 

One is never sure who is the better one - so I am open to all thoughts on this one.  Me personally, I just prefer Houye, but I think that it is my personal bias as well, because I tend to prefer the more complicated leads, period.

 

Thank you so much for reading and taking time to respond!

[Funnypeopleswim]

19 minutes ago, SnT said:

She did not die becsuse houye don  favour or love her. She died because eveyday ppl treat her like dirt because she is the shameless person who climb onto her mistress husband bed, betraying her n she still dont gain a man attention even. N she can't even shiut back n say that is not true. A form of bullying in a very narrow confined space. Something like a rape victim being told its her own fault that happen or cyberbullying. Its like being mentally  tortured daily - imagine war prisoner. she simply just lost hope w no education, no solace or help from anyone, n seeing no end to this life. 

 

 

That makes more sense to me, than her dying because of neglect or lack of love. 

 

They had polygamy in Vietnam too until Christianity and Communism. But I was raised in Canada so very different. When I visited Vietnam and saw my family, they spoke about one of my uncles have a baby wife. Which I think mean it's either his second wife or mistress, I wasn't clear. But unlike in the drama my aunt was separated from her husband by that point. They weren't all cohabitating together. 

 

There are other aspects of this that are different to me. The servitude to one's in-laws, the whole husband decided everything. 

 

I've watched harem dramas growing up too, but I just can't imagine myself in that time. Don't get me wrong I love historical dramas, but some of the situations are hard to empathise with.

[OsmanthusTea]

4 minutes ago, Funnypeopleswim said:

 

There are other aspects of this that are different to me. The servitude to one's in-laws, the whole husband decided everything. 

 

Believe it or not, this practices is still alive and flourishing in some part of Asia especially India where majority of the marriages are arranged ones. Some wives who experiencing this kind of situation aren't poor or uneducated and living in the village in the middle of no where but instead came from wealthy parent, highly educated and living in big cities. I have some Indian friends who told me the horror stories that left my jaws rattled on the floor. I also have a Chinese friend who experienced this kind of situation.

[SnT]

30 minutes ago, JennyKimWOP said:

@SnT this is insightful and thoughtful - and 15 is not that young in that era, which is why I kind of shrugged about the age difference.

 

Also, my great-grandfather had 2 concubines in Korea so my dad's side of the family, the relationships are all complicated, which is why I did not even bat an eyelid when I saw the concubine storyline.

 

I agree with you that her relationships with young Ou and the Marquis/Houye would be different.

 

One is never sure who is the better one - so I am open to all thoughts on this one.  Me personally, I just prefer Houye, but I think that it is my personal bias as well, because I tend to prefer the more complicated leads, period.

 

Thank you so much for reading and taking time to respond!

Tq for writing ur insights n thoughts too. I think we hv realky exercise our brain cells w this drama which makes it more meaningful n thoughts provoking compared to any sweet romcom. 

 

I will go for houye w shiyi too. Not everyone get that intense deep love which is sweet n beautiful at the same time. Life is only colourful if one can taste everything bitter sweet sour n salty. Not everyone can really experience that till death do us apart kinda lovw. Such togetherness is amazing n i stand in awe.

 

I remembered reading lee kuan yew memoir n his relationship w his wife seems to be like that. Such good n wise politician n a man w a heart for his ppl, standing besides him a wise understanding calm wife who supports him n never cauae any contraversial. Our 2x prime minister wife dr asmah is such woman as well. Medical Dr by training n so talented n sweet lady who never fail to stand next to her husband. 

 

My heart do ache for young ou too. Right person wrong time. If he died because of atoning of the family sins, will be a very bitter sweet finale for this drama. 

 

@OsmanthusTeamiddle eastern too. Sigh. Asian is mainly still very patriarchal. Meaning man is more reverred than woman. But i also don advocate that women should behave like men or make themselves to be as men. We all hv our roles n our quality n inner strength n characteristics. It should compliment one another not one swallowing another. Eg i can change my light bulbs but it is harder because i don have the height. Better the man do it because it is just easy peasy for them. 

Edited March 25, 2021 by SnT

[OsmanthusTea]

@JennyKimWOP @SnT

Personal preference will be HouYe for me because I prefer a Sugar Daddy especially the one like WC   It's hard not to choose HouYe because the drama is leading us to support HouYe since ShiYi never had any deep and meaningful interactions with Young Ou. We have no comparasion. But in some ways like I said before, Young Ou is better choices for us in modern time because he comes without extra baggage.

[Funnypeopleswim]

2 minutes ago, OsmanthusTea said:

 

Believe it or not, this practices is still alive and flourishing in some part of Asia especially India where majority of the marriages are arranged ones. Some wives who experiencing this kind of situation aren't poor or uneducated and living in the village in the middle of no where but instead came from wealthy parent, highly educated and living in big cities. I have some Indian friends who told me the horror stories that left my jaws rattled on the floor. I also have a Chinese friend who experienced this kind of situation.

 

I believe it. Arrange marriages are fascinating to me.  My mom used to set me up on blind dates all the time. But the candidates were all unsuitable. But my father-in-law does a lot of marriage counselling and he says they are sometimes more successful than love matches because the couple have lower expectations of each other and behave more practically.

 

@JennyKimWOP I can't predict who Shiyi would be more happy with. Both men have their own appeal. But your insights were interesting. I sort of think Shiyi is the kind of person who knows how to find her own happiness no matter who she is with. 

 

But the romantic in me supposes Houye is the one she is fated for. 

[NiteWalker]

8 minutes ago, OsmanthusTea said:

@JennyKimWOP @SnT

Personal preference will be HouYe for me because I prefer a Sugar Daddy especially the one like WC   It's hard not to choose HouYe because the drama is leading us to support HouYe since ShiYi never had any deep and meaningful interactions with Young Ou. We have no comparasion. But in some ways like I said before, Young Ou is better choices for us in modern time because he comes without extra baggage.

hahaha just stay single ... they can’t force us to marry now like they use to anyway

 

sometimes being single is a blessing

[Funnypeopleswim]

1 minute ago, NiteWalker said:

they can’t force us to marry now like they use to anyway

 

Thank god for that!

[OsmanthusTea]

@NiteWalker

Single or married has it own downside and plus side. As long as a person is happy and contented, married or single is not an issues.

[SnT]

@Funnypeopleswim u really hit the nail with ur she knows how to find happiness no matter who she is wife to. Even its wangyu she will escape or mske her life better hahaha...

 

Ya its all fate. Young ou is not only 30 sec too late on that fateful day. He is suitable but unfortunately it is not for shiyi to marry an ou. 

 

If he goes to look for that day n found her w her dead mother n stayed by her side, they may fall in love but what will happen later they found out his brother kill her mum. Then she would hv truly married her husband that has family that cause her mum death.

 

Besides lets imagine they leave on that fateful day wo her mum dying. Young ou will eventually need to go to ask for her hand in marriage n he need to do that as  ou yan xing. Those days wo parents permission it is technically an elope. N with yuanniang already married to a xu, luo will not go married off their daughter to an ou, the xu deadliest enemy. Luo will never allow it to happen..one simply cannot drink tea from two houses at the same time. So his birth n her mum death already make it impossible for him d. 

Edited March 25, 2021 by SnT

[panda-pop]

28 minutes ago, SnT said:

@Funnypeopleswim u really hit the nail with ur she knows how to find happiness no matter who she is wife to. Even its wangyu she will escape or mske her life better hahaha...

 

Ya its all fate. Young ou is not only 30 sec too late on that fateful day. He is suitable but unfortunately it is not for shiyi to marry an ou. 

 

If he goes to look for that day n found her w her dead mother n stayed by her side, they may fall in love but what will happen later they found out his brother kill her mum. Then she would hv truly married her husband that has family that cause her mum death.

 

Besides lets imagine they leave on that fateful day wo her mum dying. Young ou will eventually need to go to ask for her hand in marriage n he need to do that as  ou yan xing. Those days wo parents permission it is technically an elope. N with yuanniang already married to a xu, luo will not go married off their daughter to an ou, the xu deadliest enemy. Luo will never allow it to happen..one simply cannot drink tea from two houses at the same time. So his birth n her mum death already make it impossible for him d. 

 

That's a really good point -- once Shi Yi Niang's mother is killed by his brother, Ou Yan Xing's chances of ending up with her go down to -10%. I do think it could have worked out for the two of them if Shi Yi Niang and her mom successfully ran way with Ou Yang Xing, though. I doubt Shi Yi Niang would have cared about getting permission from her family (she's basically leaving it all behind when she decides to run away), and Ou Yang Xing would have continued living under his traveling merchant identity. Even if he told Shi Yi Niang about his real identity in this alternative reality, all the Ou / Xu feuding wouldn't cause tension in their marriage since I really don't see either of them wanting to return and live with their families. They'd probably spend their lives traveling around, having adventures and taking care of Shi Yi Niang's mom into her old age. 

 

Of course, that's a lot less interesting of a story and we wouldn't get to see our favorite Hou Ye fall in love with Shi Yi Niang  

 

10 hours ago, AwkwarDerp said:

 

subs:

Lingyi: there isn’t much time. I have to go save ShiYi 

————-

Xu Madame: ShiYi Niang, you are the main wife of the Xu Family. Even if I have to give up everything in the Xu family, I won’t give up. 
 

Officer: It’s time 

 

ShiYi: Thank you, mother! For protecting me. 
 

citizens: don’t kill her, she’s a good person

————-

=If this game, it was predicted that I will lose=
 

Ou Yan Xing: If it isn’t because of fate...Then I would be more suitable for you than Xu Lingyi. 

 

Then the end the Emperor promoted her status. 

 

 

 

 

Thanks for sharing the trailer for the final episode!! It's SO satisfying to see Madame Xu stand up for Shi Yi Niang for once. I think we all knew this drama was headed for a happy ending, but still a relief to see a glimpse of that while we wait till Monday.. 

 

Side note, anyone else think Shi Yi Niang looks extra pretty in the execution scene? Her hairstyle there really suits her! 

[AwkwarDerp]

Can I just say, I love it whenever people called him Sugar Daddy, it just make him sounds so rich 

3 hours ago, Funnypeopleswim said:

 

I believe it. Arrange marriages are fascinating to me.  My mom used to set me up on blind dates all the time. But the candidates were all unsuitable. But my father-in-law does a lot of marriage counselling and he says they are sometimes more successful than love matches because the couple have lower expectations of each other and behave more practically.

 

@JennyKimWOP I can't predict who Shiyi would be more happy with. Both men have their own appeal. But your insights were interesting. I sort of think Shiyi is the kind of person who knows how to find her own happiness no matter who she is with. 

 

But the romantic in me supposes Houye is the one she is fated for. 

My mother doesn’t set me up for blind dates but she used to do this thing where she bring people home, as like a way “look i found you a friend” and I didn’t understand at that time, cause she was like “go ahead and exchange numbers” or like recently she called and asked if i still talk to that boy. (I don’t get her intention but maybe she thinks i’m lonely?) 

 

do i look lonely? I’m wheezing over this drama too much to be lonely